NEW YORK -NEW YORK

[LUCKY DIAMOND RICH]

Yes Yes Yes to the city they call the Big Apple,
Just wondering what is the low down on the street pitchs in the Big Apple!

I am coming over in MAY,really keen to know what is up,and whos who,whats what!


LDR

[Mr.Taxi Trix]

The skinny on the city:

South Street Seaport is where to get the corporate-sanctioned, auditioned, and impure work. They are at http://www.southstreetseaport.com/go/suggform.cfm?MallID=162

Central park is still legal if you don't use an amp. Washington Square Park is where you'll thrive. Its legal, they desperately need to watch that which is unusual, and if you stay with Lee, its close to home. You'll make bucks.

[Magic Brian]

As far as Central Park goes - it's not really "legal" they will hassel you if you use an amp and especially if you use fire but you can take your chances. Some of the parks peeps are cool some aren't.
I started doing shows in Union Sq. - not too bad but now there is all kinds of construction going on totally screwing up the flow of people walking through there.
Washington Sq. is good and bad. The pitch is the fountain when it's off once it gets warm the fountain is on and a lot of performers show up - you have to wait on the weekends to do a show. Tic and Tack do a breakdance/acro type show and they take a long time sometimes so it's hard to get one in.
The Met is another possibility. Never played there but there are people coming out if you hit it at the right time.

[Triona]

NYC, fugget about...

It is only legal in Central Park with a permit that can be obtained from the Parks department and there is only one performing zone, just on the other side of the children's zoo. One of the pitches is already taken, Dave has been juggling in the same spot for probably 20 years. The other spot may or may not be taken yet. The permit is monthly and specifies where and on what day you can perform. You have to get a separate permit for each day you want to work. There is absolutely no fire, you'll go to jail in a heartbeat with or without the permit (they just void your permit). Even after going through all the channels, you may still get arrested and your props confiscated. We're hoping things loosen up now that the Fuhrer is no longer the mayor, but this is the current situation. The only safe thing is twisting balloons for tips. I've been doing it for two years now, and I've only been quizzed once by the parks people. They thought I was a little crazy for giving stuff away, but there's no law against it.

As far as Washington Sq., there are no permits, it is not legal. You'll probably get away with it, no fire though the cops only look the other way so far. As Brian said, Tic and Tac use this pitch and so does Master Lee. I caught his show last summer, it was cool to see someone perform that I had read about in books on busking. My partner tried a show in the fountain, but without a sound system it's hard to get and keep a crowd. I doubt they'll have the fountain on this year, this whole area is in a drought emergency.

Unfortunately, New York is not the street performer friendly city it used to be. My partner was a street performer there for over 10 years and is always reminising when there were performers in the parks at many different pitches. Wish we could bring back Ed Koch.... frown.gif

[ 02-21-2002: Message edited by: Triona ]</p>

[LUCKY DIAMOND RICH]

Thanks guys,
I am really looking forward to coming to N.Y!
It has been along time coming,and this is the year for me!see you all out there,and all the best!thanks again.........

LDR

[Triona]

Hey LDR,

We'll keep an eye out for you. I'm not there every weekend, but I'm usually on the 66th Street side of the Children's Zoo. Look for the neon green and purple jester's outfit! <img src="graemlins/jester.gif" border="0" alt="[jester]" />

[scot]

I performed on 05-26-2002 in Wash. and had a great time. I'll be going back for more this summer when off the tour.

The fountain was easy to work w/out sound

[Triona]

Washington Square is not all that bad, you just have to watch your back a bit. The Balloon Guy got stabbed there last year, there's still a lot of drug activity and they just had a guy go nuts not too far from there and shoot a bunch of people.

It's a good place if you have an unusual show. Your run of the mill kiddie show isn't going to cut it.

Glad to hear the performers are coming back.

[gazzo osborne]

It's a good place if you have an unusual show. Your run of the mill kiddie show isn't going to cut it.

Bullshit. I have seen Peter Gross do very, very good shows in Washington Square Park.

[Triona]

You know Gazzo, I only know of you by what others have said about you on this board and your posts. As it stands right now, I think you're one of the nastiest most obnoxious people on the face of the earth (and you're probably quite proud of it).

I have no idea who this Peter Gross is, but I've been going to WS Park for the past three years and the only acts I've seen make money were Tic n Tac and Master Lee. Both of these are very high energy and definitely unique.

Perhaps you are thinking of an earlier time when there was a great deal of street performing in NYC...

[gazzo osborne]

yes!

[Danny Hustle]

[quote]Originally posted by Triona:
<strong>You know Gazzo, I only know of you by what others have said about you on this board and your posts. As it stands right now, I think you're one of the nastiest most obnoxious people on the face of the earth (and you're probably quite proud of it).

...</strong><hr></blockquote>

Triona, I think you might have missed the joke. I think gazzo was having a piss at his pal Peter Gross not out to offend you. smile.gif

[LUCKY DIAMOND RICH]

Triona,
get over yourself,will you!
I only really respect people that have some experience in what they are talking about!
Gazzo is one of the Kings of the Street,and is also someone that has experience in what he talks about!
Gazzo hit a nerve,or what!

LDR

[gazzo osborne]

Don't SUCK UP to me LDR- if anyboday you have to suck up to is BIKE BOY!!!! 'cause when he's done with Ala' Concentrick {you know - the POLE guy- the guy who doesn't have an act} - he's coming after you!!! So get ready to part your cheecks { from what I hear Richie- it won't even touch the sides}- thanx anyway...
When are you coming to Boston???? That POLE guy-he's making $700 per show-and all the Boston "boys" told em not to tell anyone- so keep it under the table...eh??!!!


Rules??? There are no rules!!!! Keep in mind- you can fuck everybody in life-except 6 people-'cause you'll need people to carry your casket!!! TA-TA

Gazzo

[gazzo osborne]

fuck this shit i'm retiring again

[gazzo osborne]

rules there are no rules
but from what i hear bike boy has a 12"inch but he dont use it has a rule..... so run LDR

[DEBBIE ROBINSON]

QUOTE : Gazzo
"Rules??? There are no rules!!!! Keep in mind- you can fuck everybody in life-except 6 people-'cause you'll need people to carry your casket!!!...."

Or in your case 12
Lay off the pies whale man.
Order some sushi.

[Triona]

Excuse me your greatness... I have a lot of experience, from the most important side of the street. The person putting money in your hat!!! I've been to Washington Square and I've seen the acts. I've seen some really good ones, like Tic n Tac and Master Lee, and I've seen some really bad ones. When I originally posted to this thread it was to let you know the current situation in NYC. My roommate was a street performer there for better than ten years, and we still go back from time to time, but the permit situation kind of nixes his juggling show. There's no way in hell I'm going to let him risk a thousand dollars worth of props for a show that could have them and it's hat confiscated. I didn't want to see you get busted and lose your props. Sorry I tried to look out for you. I'm glad you did well and nothing bad happened. Forwarned is for armed though.

[quote]Originally posted by LUCKY diamond RICH:
<strong>I only really respect people that have some experience in what they are talking about!</strong><hr></blockquote>

[Triona]

Gazzo, I thought I was getting another attitude like LDR's again. I only tried to relate what I knew about the current situation in NYC. I'm usually up there at least once a month (more often in the summer). I wondered about this Peter Gross person, I've never seen him, or at least don't think I have...

Anyway, I like the bit about the six... More people should remember it.

[ALAKAZAM]

Gazzo,shhh?don't tell the people i was making hats that small it's embarrasing.
AL biggrin.gif

[scot]

I believe any decent act will do well in Washington Square Park.

Adultness and uniqueness are not qualities that really matter that much. eg- Tic & Tac are not that unique and Hector (the swordsman of WSP) aims his show at attracting 8yr old women.

I could tell it was a joke off the bat. I couldn't imagine Peter Gross ever did well there without a kilo. I'm sure Gazzo was there still trying to prove his putridity and making a few bucks.

[LUCKY DIAMOND RICH]

Gazzo,
it is not long Old Timer,so I will be one of the 6!
But remember one man can not carry it!

Oh,I have seen your show!Going through the MOTIONS is a form of retirement,anyway!

You can walk trough your life and shows mate,but not me!

Something for Nick Nickalos to aspire to anyway!

As for Bike Boy,he has been ripping off peoples shit for years!
eg.he even started getting heavily tattooed for a while,work that out!

No threat to me,mate!


LDR

[gazzo osborne]

LDR try 8oz not 20,.... and.......

[ 07-19-2002: Message edited by: gazzo osborne ]

[ 07-19-2002: Message edited by: gazzo osborne ]</p>

[Irina]

South Street Seaport is getting more and more corporate every year - they always had schedules for performers, but nobody gave a damn, but now they really start to check everybody, especially at the Pier 17 entrance...The business is down everywhere - you can feel the decline in tourism. Other pitches are - Battery Park, where folks board the ferry to the Statue of Liberty, front steps of Metropolitan Museum, Betheda Fountain in Central Park (good for big shows - it's a huge open space). There are a lot of street fairs, some of them are crashable, some are not. Usually if it's organized by a production Co, like Mardi Gras productions etc - they are no good for buskers, as they try to sell every bit of space, but local church/national community festivals are very busker-friendly and you can always get permission to work, sometimes they ask for a donation to the church or non-profit... Good site to find local festivals in NYC and other touristy places is www.carnaval.com (http://www.carnaval.com)

[Triona]

[quote]Originally posted by Irina:
<strong>front steps of Metropolitan Museum, Betheda Fountain in Central Park (good for big shows - it's a huge open space). </strong><hr></blockquote>

Either of these places will at best get you run at worst get you arrested (especially in front of the museum). The artists that used to sit out there have been routinely getting arrested and all of their works confiscated and sold at police auction. There's an artist from the Village Voice (don't recall his name) that has been arrested over 100 times in that location. He was on a major rant about Guiliani for years, he used to draw cartoons with Rudy with a Hitler mustache.

There are only three approved areas for street performing in Central Park and you must have a special events permit (this is right from the Parks Department). Good luck in getting the permit. They took my non-refundable $25 processing fee back in March and still haven't approved or rejected my application which was for the second and third weekend in June. I have to contact the Central Park director again mad.gif

[quote]<strong>There are a lot of street fairs, some of them are crashable, some are not. Usually if it's organized by a production Co, like Mardi Gras productions etc - they are no good for buskers, as they try to sell every bit of space, but local church/national community festivals are very busker-friendly and you can always get permission to work, sometimes they ask for a donation to the church or non-profit... Good site to find local festivals in NYC and other touristy places is www.carnaval.com (http://www.carnaval.com)</strong><hr></blockquote>

The local fairs are sometimes cool, but just about anything going on on 6th Avenue is a waste. They're all run by some company who are the most miserable people I have ever talked to. If you want to pay them $200+ for a space, great, otherwise they tell you to f**k off.

[ 07-19-2002: Message edited by: Triona ]</p>

[martin ewen]

This interests me.
I don't want to get into discussions re the worth of Performance/service/product combo's.
( I could see how authorities might immediately stomp on people producing painted faces/balloons/work on canvas or pavement; simply because they see tangible business taking place)
Instead I'd like to ask when the last performer got arrested at the met.
I worked there last year and used to get in and out pretty quick.
I had planned on returning.
I could also understand how shouting, manipulating, high impact acts could be too much for the place.
So maybe not the last performer moved on rather the last silent one??
Anybody??
It did seem pretty quiet, i sort of felt i was getting away with something I shouldn't have been doing.
Do you think it would help if i waved a wee american flag?
(Its my newest prop-I love it-Its really funny)

[Triona]

[quote]Originally posted by martin ewen:
<strong>This interests me.
Instead I'd like to ask when the last performer got arrested at the met.
I worked there last year and used to get in and out pretty quick.
I had planned on returning.
I could also understand how shouting, manipulating, high impact acts could be too much for the place.
So maybe not the last performer moved on rather the last silent one??
Anybody??
It did seem pretty quiet, i sort of felt i was getting away with something I shouldn't have been doing.
Do you think it would help if i waved a wee american flag?
(Its my newest prop-I love it-Its really funny)</strong><hr></blockquote>

It's my understanding from my partner that the Met has pretty much been off-limits to regular circle shows for years. Now he does have a rather loud, flashy act, he's a juggler after all, so that may be the reason.

I doubt the flag waving would help, Martin. New York is still getting over 9/11 and while it's business as usual for the most part, there's still a odd feeling.

The other reason you might have gotten away with it was the parks guys might have thought you were hired by the museum. I'm guessing you were on your stilts, so they probably figured you had to have been hired because who would be crazy enough to do an illegal street show on 9-foot stilts! Little did they know.... biggrin.gif

[Doctor Eric]

I'd like to open this thread back up, as I'm planning on being in NY real soon, and it seems like things have been changing on a daily basis there. What is it like now? Is there any where that you CAN use fire? My friend says that a lot of college kids mess around with fire in union square, so why not a performer?

[Miss Banana]

Ummm.... well, Clarke and I got our equipment confiscated by parks enforcement plus clarke was issued with a couple of summonses and fines in November 2002 in the fountain.

Definitely NO FIRE!!!! Definitely NO AMPLIFICATION!!!

Beware new york enforcement officers. You can still do shows, just be aware of police presence.

As far as the college kids spinning fire goes, I think they run if they spot cops.

[Pyromancer]

Samen in London... Went there little time ago, with the idea of building around an extended fire eating routine, nice and clean, not a single drop of oil on the floor, but absolutely no fire is allowed.
Tried to develop something without fire, but that took more time than I thought it would, to put it mildy. At some point I actually did some fire and got away with it. But maybe I was just lucky...

[ 05-13-2003: Message edited by: Pyromancer ]</p>

[Miss Banana]

Ok. I think this thread definitely needs a panel discussion. It is silly to feel like a criminal because you want to entertain people on the streets of New York. I need to work up my show and am finding it difficult due to the no permit, no amp, no fire issue. No fire is easier to deal with than no amp. But I wanna go somewhere to make money with a street show and I just to get out there to practice it more often than I can now (which is not at all at the moment) so that I can actually have a structured piece to tour with. Arghh!!! Frustration!!! How can I practice when it is illegal?

Do we need to band together to create new pitches or fight the noise ordinance?

Just came back from NOLA where they are trying to make it illegal as well. Why are enforcement officers in the USA not concentrating on actual violent crimes?

I would have put this in another topic but I believe it is vital and more specific to the NYC street scene.

[Pyromancer]

Fire is banned completely everywhere, just because *some* people can't be responsible, leave a giant mess or just don't know what they are doing in general...
After my show, there will be drops on the floor. Some. I have seen people making a bigger mess while soaking a single torch, than I make during my full 30 minuit fire-only show.

And ofcourse, the hysteria around "safety" doesn't help much either. Appearently, we need to live in a safe, harmless world. Every potential danger has to be removed. Because people are afraid, to every insurers' delight. But moreover, because people are becoming more and more incapable of carrying any responsibility for themselves. You trip over? Normal response would be the conclusion that you should look better next time. But nowadays people rather sue someone else for their own mistakes...

Who is making the rules and why?!? In Covent Garden, the rule is no voice amplification, but music is allowed. In Amsterdam at the Leidseplein the rules are opposite: absolutely no music, but use your microphone as much as you like. Anyone here, who can come up with some general applicable logic?

[ 05-26-2003: Message edited by: Pyromancer ]</p>

[Steven Ragatz]

I think it naive of us to expect things like fire manipulation, and especially, fire breathing to be accepted outside of the most controlled environments. Claiming that the imposed restrictions are due to law suit happy trends is only part of the picture. In reality, there is danger, and one that is in many respects, unnecessary. Because of the venue, namely on the street, there is little real control over the behavior of the audience. As the performer, their safety must be paramount in our minds - but much of the time it isn't. More often than not, we are willing to risk physical injury to someone in the audience for the sake of a bit or a laugh. It can be very entertaining, but is it any surprise that others are not willing to take those risks as well? I understand and accept that this aspect is one of the elements that makes street performing so appealing, but have to acknowledge that it probably won't fly with anyone who is taking on the responsibility for the audience, whether that be police, or producer.

The role of performer is inherently one that carries responsibility. You have a responsibility to your audience's mental, emotional as well as physical well being. They are your best friend and should be treated with the appropriate respect that they deserve.

No matter what you do, or how careful you are, doing fire is dangerous. The fuel is toxic, highly flammable and always being used around an open flame. It doesn't take a OSHA license to figure that one out. Moreover, it's dirty, smells and makes smoke. Considering the number of cities that are adopting ordinances against cigarette smoke in public, it should come as no surprise that they might not also have a problem with open gasoline flames.

The accident a few months back at the Great White concert should be a sobering experience for all of us that do fire manipulation. There have been other tragedies because of pyrotechnic acts, but that one in particular hit home due to the heavy publicity. It is all to easy to say that they were negligent and that "I am different - I am careful and safe." If you truly believe that you are infallible, then I believe that you are lying. There is risk, and the risk is real, and that's why it is such a powerful theatrical element. But we can't possibly have any grounds to think that others will be willing to share that risk with us as we ply our trade for a few bills and coins in the bottom of a hat.

Steven Ragatz

[ 05-26-2003: Message edited by: Steven Ragatz ]</p>

[Miss Banana]

Woah there hoss...

I was merely bringing up the issue of the lack of pitches in one of the largest most populated and most touristed cities in the world. Fire is an entirely different issue. I am personally trying to phase out the fire aspect in my show exactly because of all the various restrictions around the world. Hell though, everything is dangerous is it not?

No fire should be another thread. I am discussing new york's inability to welcome street performers into their city. Yes it is illegal to perform anywhere (south seaport excepted) unless you have a permit from the parks authorities which you must reapply for every month with a nonrefundable $25 fee, and half of applications get "lost" in the system somewhere anyway.

No amplification anywhere... well hey, in the "city that never sleeps" we are finding that the financially well endowed prefer sleep to all might raves, but there appears to be no increase in fines for the car alarms that go off incessantly through all hours of the night or the honking taxis that keep me awake. It just seems that "they" are enforcing the wrong things here. real, violent crimes are still occuring and enforcemnt are spending their time confiscating a street performer's amplifier, or a venue for allowing people to smoke inside or dance without a cabaret licence.

Sure, street performers should be regulated and why shouldn't the city get a slice of the performer's pie? Hell everyone else seems to need a permit for their business... but there should be realistic ways of regulating it rather than making it a criminal offence to be an entertainer.

I am just venting my frustration at feeling boxed in in this town.AS for washington square park, enforcement are total assholes in that park. It is not a realistic pitch... especially for new females trying to fight their way in for a slot.

[Miss Banana]

I meant that I was a new performer to the street who happens to be female, not a new female...

[Steven Ragatz]

OK, so you don't want to talk about fire...

If you want to get practice so that you can develop a touring show, hook up with a business and perform under their umbrella. Restaurant walk arounds or being hired by a festival/marketplace may suit you. You may not be passing the hat, and the money may not be all that great, but you will be able to do the work and get it on its feet. I found that theme park, and related work, was especially good for this sort of thing. No glory while you are there, but it beats not doing anything at all.

Steven Ragatz

[Pyromancer]

Well, I do want to talk about fire, Mr Ragatz. As it is my profession.

But let's take this discussion to a different thread (http://www.performers.net/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=6&t=000142) indeed.

David Boelee aka Pyromancer

[ 05-27-2003: Message edited by: Pyromancer ]</p>