chainsaw question

[Riot Nrrrd]

Okay, so . . . chainsaw juggling.

I got a small chainsaw, but a new handle on it, replaced the blade with a fake one, practiced with an approximate-weight mock up, then practiced with the saw with a fake blade - all of course leading up to juggling the real saw with the real blade. Today however, I started the thing up and threw it around, and discovered something I'd expected to be a factor, but not such a major factor - the torque of the motor causing the thing to spin oddly in the air.

Is this torque issue just something I have to learn to deal with/compensate for, or are there ways of limiting it?

What other advice does anybody have for a beginning chainsaw juggler, other than the very obvious "don't." ?

thanks a lot,
Riot Nrrrd
(playing with power tools while I should be watching Star Trek)

[Tyler]

Hmm, you could be able to rig the thing so nothing in it actually runs. Play the music in the background or something. ;-)

If you are intent on having this thing run, try and find out where it is spinning funny, for example hatchets juggle weird because they have weight at one end. Perhaps you could weight it some more in a different place. I don't juggle chainsaws, so what I suggest may not work.

-Tyler

[Tyler]

Oh, is hte chain actually running? That could cause it if it is.

-Tyler

[Riot Nrrrd]

Thanks Tyler, but the issue is not weight distribution (as I said, I've juggled the actual saw while it wasn't running) The problem is the torque, the gyroscopic action of the spinning parts of the engine. Anybody out there who's dealt with this and can offer insight?

[Stretch]

Not an expert, not even an amateur! but from what I remember seeing, watching those who did this act, you need to add a counter weighted handle. Possibly, a sliding weight. Ball bearings inside a hollow handle for example. or not.

Oh, and have you concidered removing the teeth from the chain?

Also, different brands of chainsaw may very well behave differently. I had an uncle who was a wizard at felling trees, and I know he had his favorites. Some would tire you out faster than others. He is deceased - old age - at 93 - and saws are better now, but I can remember him in his 70's talking about it. Some vibrated more than others.

Oh, they now sell kevlar chaps and clothing for lumberjacks, to help prevent injuries., you might check it out for your practice sessons.

Good luck!

[Mr.Taxi Trix]

Never tried it. Why not practice with the saw running, with a fake blade?

[Doctor Eric]

Thom Brittain knows about this, I guess there's a guy that makes chainsaws for juggling, and judging by Thom's meager amount of skill, they can't be that hard to juggle. For now, you could just throw down something soft, and try to adjust your throws, learning something difficult never hurt anyone, except for every drooling, celibate, inarticulate magic geek on the planet.

[Butterfly Man]

Torque is God's way of telling you to get an act.

[Chance]

You said you did the handle yourself. (Unlike some morons here, this moron actually reads the original post before replying.) This is your problem; you can't just throw on any handle, in any location that happens to look okay. It must be sized and weighted (material type, length, thickness, wrappings, ect.)... PLUS... it must be precisely positioned to counter-balance the torque problem.

Obviously, since you are already stuck with the saw, this will take a little R&D. Every saw will be different, there is no formula to work from.

(But look on the bright side: After you get the bugs worked out, you buy two dozen more saws, work them over, and make a nice profit on your experience.)

Good luck!

[mjsaab]

There is a company in Australia who makes a chainsaw specifically for juggling. They come in very small sizes and appear to be very light. The handle is mounted at the base. I don’t know the company name but I think the saws are usually orange the handle on the end is very thick and about 6 inches.

Of the people I've seen doing the juggling chainsaw act there seems to be a lot of talk and build up then finally when you get to really juggling the damn thing there are about three to six passes and your done!

I always thought that the chain on the saw was gaffed. Meaning the teeth were filed down. The audience doesn’t have to know besides you could prove to them the authenticity of the saw by carving up a water mellow apple, potato or some other kind of melon. I can’t imagine why any one would ever want to use a real blade. You could be a master juggler and still have one accident that ruins you.

Good Luck!!

[Chance]

Sure the chain is gaffed. The teeth are MISSING.

[Tyler]

The ones from australia cost around 800-900 dollars. The site is www.juggleart.com. Hope that helps.

-Tyler

[Thom]

1) the chainsaw is 800 - 900 Australian dollars. Big difference there.

2) torque is just something you adjust for. Juggle more, practice more.

It ain't rocket science. Just keep at it.

[Riot Nrrrd]

Thanks for advice so far,

So . . . I've got one source telling me the handle needs to be specifically placed, and another telling me to just adjust . . . Thom, am I correct in thinking that you use a chainsaw whose handle was carefully placed by somebody else?

And to that end - how do I go about determining where to put a handle, to counteract the gyroscope effect? Trial and error is one thing, but that's a lot of cutting and grinding and welding and cutting. Anybody got any clue as to how to go about looking for the ideal point?

I think I'll continue to just play with the saw while it's running, and see if an approach becomes intuitively obvious . . . not sure I know exactly where to begin though. I'll admit (don't tell anybody!) that I'm more of an arts-nerd than a physics-geek.

Thanks,
Riot Nrrrd (Calum S.)

[Scot Free]

Originally posted by Chance
You said you did the handle yourself. (Unlike some morons here, this moron actually reads the original post before replying.) This is your problem; you can't just throw on any handle, in any location that happens to look okay.

Yes you can. I drilled 3 holes in the alluminum body of a Poulin Pro saw and bolted an alluminum pipe to the bottom. Added a little duct tape and presto....piece of cake.

Originally posted by Chance

It must be sized and weighted (material type, length, thickness, wrappings, ect.)... PLUS... it must be precisely positioned to counter-balance the torque problem.


No it doesnt. Counter-balance counter-smalance.
The very simple solution to solve the torque problem is to hold the saw with the bottom facing the audience and start the juggle from that position.
It is easier to juggle a saw while it is running with the trigger taped down. The C-force from the chain spinning helps the flip when it is thrown with the bottom facing out.

[Riot Nrrrd]

So, yeah, once I found the right axis to throw it on (basically as Scot says, starting with bottom out) the torque issue became negligable. I can now toss the saw with a reasonable degree of precision.

My next tasks - baby the engine so that I can actually keep it running for more than a few throws, and dumb-down the real blade and put it back on.

Thanks for all the help,

Riot Nrrrd
(still playing with power tools intead of Dungeons and Dragons)

[Chance]

Scot, where were you when I needed you?... So many things I could have just fudged, but instead I went the scientific route. What a waste!

On the serious side, though, since you don't have his machine in front of you for comparison, you might have just given him a serious case of carpal tunnel by next year. Nothing wrong with learning about correct weight distribution and balance, especially when it concerns your livlihood and overall safety.

My .02, and worth every cent.