performers.net forums  

Go Back   performers.net forums > GENERAL DISCUSSIONS... > PROMO STUFF (MARKETING, MEDIA, ETC.)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 02-01-08, 01:50 AM   #1
charliekarl
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: on the road
Posts: 38
Default New promo vid, would love som feedback

Hello there.

I've got a new video and would love some feedback. Check it out on:
http://www.catchmagic.com/video.php

Cheers
--
Charlie Caper
charliekarl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-08, 05:42 AM   #2
Lee Nelson
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: departure lounge
Posts: 353
Default super effort

One of the nicest videos I have ever seen

well done
Lee Nelson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-08, 10:52 AM   #3
Jim
Your Host
 
Jim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Boston, MA USA
Posts: 1,093
Blog Entries: 6
Default

That was a great video.

I've never seen your act, but you seem very talented and likeable.

My only criticism... the "head-turn-kiss" thing has got to go. Not just from the video, but from your act. It's hack and un-necessary.

Everything about your presence says "A touch of class" and "professional" but when I saw that, I cringed. It doesen't fit your character and it makes you look like an amateur.

And I'm not just picking on you, I think every performer should just stop doing that... It's the oldest, tiredest, lamest, cheapest laugh in the book.

Seriously, though... everything else it great.
__________________
Jim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-08, 12:30 PM   #4
Rachel Peters
Moderator
 
Rachel Peters's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Toronto/Hamilton
Posts: 1,396
Default

Hear Hear!
...Yeah, for a long-ish video, it's entirely full of content! I wanted to watch it all, to the very end, and then some more.
But cheek-kiss -- I concur. I always, always cringe at it. Probably even more than Jim, considering I'm a girl and a potential victim for it.
__________________
Well, maybe I WILL just keep telling myself that.

www.rachelpeters.com
Rachel Peters is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-08, 03:18 PM   #5
scot
Senior Member
 
scot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Hollywood
Posts: 1,169
Send a message via AIM to scot
Scot

I love the cheek kiss gag. You gotta get some play some way. You know, for ugly guys, it might be the only kisses they get. I personally don't need the gag because I'm funny, charming and attractive, but go for it if you need it.

I tried to be the firs to post a response, but my computer wasn't working well last night.

It's too long. Everything's great, but it's too long. each of the places you've been can be shortened and, instead of putting the location as a subtitle, make it a title -- right across the middle of the frame.

I wouldn't say that it's too long if it was necessary. You show a lot of good stuff, just cut out lag.

I can't believe Jim posted something.
__________________
scot@jugglegood.com
scot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-08, 08:11 PM   #6
Jim
Your Host
 
Jim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Boston, MA USA
Posts: 1,093
Blog Entries: 6
Ass

Quote:
Originally posted by scot

I can't believe Jim posted something.
Hey, I have strong feelings about the stupid cheek kiss, OK?

I do agree with Scot on the other stuff. It could be about a minute shorter if you tightened a few things up. You don't have to get rid of scenes, just shave a bit off each clip.
__________________
Jim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-08, 11:35 PM   #7
Mike Weakley
Member
 
Mike Weakley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 80
Default cheek-kiss bit

I may be in the minority here, but I say keep the cheek-kiss bit. Sure, it is one of the oldest, tiredest, lamest, cheapest laugh in the book; but the general public loves it. People watching a show still laugh when they see that. And when you're performing a show, who are you more interested in pleasing... the people watching you and potentially filling your hat, or a group fellow entertainers on a website in cyberspace?
Mike Weakley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-08, 11:56 PM   #8
Jim
Your Host
 
Jim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Boston, MA USA
Posts: 1,093
Blog Entries: 6
Default Re: cheek-kiss bit

Quote:
Originally posted by Mike Weakley
I may be in the minority here, but I say keep the cheek-kiss bit. Sure, it is one of the oldest, tiredest, lamest, cheapest laugh in the book; but the general public loves it. People watching a show still laugh when they see that. And when you're performing a show, who are you more interested in pleasing... the people watching you and potentially filling your hat, or a group fellow entertainers on a website in cyberspace?

You've just summed up what's wrong with the entire street performing scene...

"It gets a laugh, so I'll just keep doing it."

----------------------------
Don't stop to ask yourself if it's stolen.

Don't stop to ask yourself if it's cheap.

Don't stop to ask yourself if it's been done since the beginning of time.

Don't stop to ask yourself if it's actually "funny" or if the reaction your getting is merely an uncomfortable chuckle.

Don't stop to ask yourself if it looks professional. (It doesn't.)

Don't stop to ask yourself if it even fits your character. (It probably doesn't.)

Don't stop to ask yourself if there is a way to twist it and make it even funnier and fit your character better.

No, just keep doing it because it "gets a laugh." You'll be fine. Have fun working on the street for the rest of your career next to a dozen other acts doing the same jokes.

Damn, I'm turning into the Butterfly Man.
__________________
Jim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-08, 12:53 AM   #9
Mike Weakley
Member
 
Mike Weakley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 80
Default

Wow Jim... you certainly do have some strong feelings about this. I admire anyone who strives to be original in their performing. There definitely needs to be more of that. But I see nothing wrong with an occasional cheap bit thrown in if it still gets a laugh. However, if the entire act is nothing but old, cheap, stolen bits, then that's another issue.

As far as the kiss-cheek bit being "funny" or just an uncomfortable reaction, it all depends on how it's done. (You know... it's not "what" you do, but "how" you do it). The reaction Charlie got in the video was definitely laughter... real laughter. The audience loved it! There was nothing at all uncomfortable about their reaction. I thought the way he did the bit was very professional and fit his character quite well. Not everyone could pull it off like that, but he sure did. As long as you can get that kind of reaction from doing an occasional cheap bit, I say keep doing it. Remember, if they laugh, it's funny. If they don't, it ain't. And... a cheap bit well done is a well done cheap bit.
Mike Weakley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-08, 01:13 AM   #10
Jim
Your Host
 
Jim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Boston, MA USA
Posts: 1,093
Blog Entries: 6
Default

Mike,

I guess we disagree. My honest opinion is that that one clip in his video weakened my impression of him. Everything was going along just fine and suddenly, he went for the cheek-kiss-bit and I immediately thought, "hack." I will say that he did it better than some people, but it's still a weak joke that he doesn't need! He's a strong, professional, likeable performer. If he took it out, his show would not suffer and people like me and thousands of other audience members and potential clients who have seen that bit a million times won't think he's a hack.

I'm not trying to be argumentative or start a flame war. I just wish more performers would take a look at their shows and edit out the tired, old, stock shit that doesn't belong to them. I know it's never going to happen... but if we could just get rid of the cheek kiss bit, we'd be off to a good start.
__________________
Jim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-08, 01:07 PM   #11
scot
Senior Member
 
scot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Hollywood
Posts: 1,169
Send a message via AIM to scot
Butterfly

Don't give in, Jim. You don't disagree.

Mike, quit it. Get rid of the cheek kiss gag. It's only a short burst of laughter. The stupidest person in the world could work for a week to come up with a replacement that got the same reaction. It isn't that you disagree with Jim, it's that you're trying to justify your own laziness.

Why don't you try to give everyone in your audience a fresh show with original everything (including tricks and jokes and setups and costume)?

that one second clip in his video will not make him more hireable, but it could make him less.

if you don't strive for originality, you don't admire it very much do you? You don't admire it more than say, being lazy.
__________________
scot@jugglegood.com

Last edited by scot; 02-02-08 at 01:10 PM.
scot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-08, 01:27 PM   #12
Butterfly Man
Refurbished Member
 
Butterfly Man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Farthest point south in US
Posts: 1,606
Scot turning into the Butterfly Man

The bitch is ugly ... if you want to keep the bit, just put a bag over her head first.

Better yet, turn her head into a coke can then stomp on it ... not original but it fits your character.
__________________
butterflyman.com
Butterfly Man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-08, 02:40 PM   #13
scot
Senior Member
 
scot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Hollywood
Posts: 1,169
Send a message via AIM to scot
Mime

ha
__________________
scot@jugglegood.com
scot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-08, 01:50 AM   #14
Mike Weakley
Member
 
Mike Weakley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 80
Default

Jim,
Yes we do disagree, but that's cool. I was pretty sure I was going to be in the minority on this one anyway, but still wanted to voice my opinion. Like you, I'm not trying to start an argument here. One thing we do agree on is that from the video we saw, Charlie is a very strong, talented performer. He looked like he was having even more fun than his audiences were. I really enjoyed watching his video.

And Scott... you seem to have some strong feelings on this as well. By all means, you are entitled to your opinion. I know I'm not going to change you mind on this, and I'm not even trying to. I'm just giving my point of view on the subject. I do believe, however, that the one second clip you were referring to WILL make him more hireable. Did you hear the reaction from the audience when he did that? That was real laughter... they loved it! That's EXACTLY what potential clients want to see. Crowds of people laughing loudly, applauding, and truly enjoying themselves. If Charlie, or anyone else, can get that kind of reaction just by throwing in some quick, cheap bit, I say go for it. I realize you don't agree with me... no biggy. But please don't think I'm trying to start some sort of flame war with you because I'm not. I'm way too lazy to do anything like that.
Mike Weakley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-08, 05:54 AM   #15
Lee Nelson
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: departure lounge
Posts: 353
Default i said it before

I am with Mike on that Charlie. It doesnt demean your video at all. It makes you more hireable in my opinion.
The kiss gag is perfect old school comedy. The true genius of the trick is not the kiss but knowing when is the right moment to do it. Anyone can do it but only experience teaches you when to maximise its effect. It looked like a pretty maximised moment to me in the show.
Sometimes I do it to men!! It provides an interesting twist on an old staple!
One other thing...I saw you perform about 3 years back Charlie. The video is you. It isnt an edited down video of you to make you look better. It is a true and accurate representation of what you are and what you can do.
I think that video will serve you well and if you are really lucky you wont have to change it for years!!

Good Luck
Lee
Lee Nelson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-08, 06:35 AM   #16
charliekarl
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: on the road
Posts: 38
Default cheers

Thanks for all the feedback so far. I really appreciate it and realize the value of your points.

I'll try to make it shorter when I next work on it, but I wanted long bits of routines in there to show what I really do, rather than quick cuts and flashes. It's bloody hard to cut away more without losing a sense of continuity.

I might take the kiss gag out of my show and video after the very valid points Jim raised. The reasons I haven't done it before are many.

To start with I ask the girl if she'll kiss me (cut out of video) and her reaction to the uncomfortable question serve as vital misdirection for a secret move. It's an integral part of the method of a trick. Also I have some funny, original lines related to asking the question that I would love to keep.

I spend fifteen minutes finding the right girl to kiss. Still, one show out of twenty I don't do it if i feel theres a chance of her reacting badly. on those instances I do loose a bit of momentum and if it's a street show I loose a larger than 10% of the hat.

I don't use it as a small gag. It comes at the end of a series of effects and it's like riding a wave of reactions and the kiss gag really tops it since it's not a magic effect.

It'll be really har to take out if I choose to.
charliekarl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-08, 08:47 AM   #17
Jim
Your Host
 
Jim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Boston, MA USA
Posts: 1,093
Blog Entries: 6
Default

Ahhhhhh... See, Charlie? That's different. That's what I was talking about. You've changed my position on this. (For YOUR situation.)

All I saw in the promo was the stock move. And that is how 95% of hack acts do it. They finish a stunt, go over to the volunteer and make the move without any prior build-up. It almost never fits the character of the act and it looks cheap.

Hearing how you do it makes complete sense now. And I totally understand the WAY you do it fits your character.

I like the idea of asking for a kiss and getting denied, then flirting with the kiss for several minutes. Then winning her over so she actually goes for a peck on the cheek and finally, stealing a smooch on the lips. That's how it should be done!

I think you could even edit that progression into the video. I'd put the initial "asking for the kiss" early on, then go to other clips, then come back to the same volunteer and show tension building. Then go away to some other clips, then bring the climax back at the end of the promo. It would certainly make the final head turn far more powerful and tie everything together.

I'm glad you came back and explained yourself. Watching your video, I was taken aback by that clip. It didn't go with the professionalism and confidence I saw in the rest of the promo.

Oh, and... This is not a complete turn around on my position! I still think 95% of the people who do the head-turn-kiss are doing it wrong. And for those 95% of people, it should not be a part of their show. Doing it to an unsuspecting volunteer for a quick laugh is lazy and cheap and makes a lot of people uncomfortable. However, with the right CHARACTER, the right build-up, and complete confidence in your volunteer and your audience, I see now how it can be an effective punchline.
__________________
Jim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-08, 02:28 PM   #18
scot
Senior Member
 
scot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Hollywood
Posts: 1,169
Send a message via AIM to scot
Scot

you still didn't come up with it. invent something else to replace it. I believe building your act around a hack bit is even worse.
__________________
scot@jugglegood.com
scot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-08, 08:57 PM   #19
charliekarl
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: on the road
Posts: 38
Default

Hello Jim

I didn't have you down on a change of mind on that one. Cool! For the record though I don't play with the kiss for several minutes. But it plays a part in my act as i need to ask the quiestion for method reasons (with some original jokes attached to that) and it really adds another bounce on the applause.

Hello Scot

You are very right. I do not condone, recommend or like using hack bits. As soon as I come up with a good replacement it's gone. I don't use too many hack bits and I want to use less. I am a cups an balls magic show but very far from Gazzo's personality which is rare. You are right. I will strive to change it out asap.
charliekarl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-07-08, 03:04 PM   #20
jimmy talksalot
Member
 
jimmy talksalot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: my home is new orleans but i'm not always there
Posts: 87
Default

charlie,

brilliant...as always.
jimmy talksalot is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:33 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.